This video is generating
a lot of reaction within Reformed circles.... a lot of people are saying, wait
a minute, what are we doing here? This is particularly problematic within the
Confessional sphere. The bulk of their churches have abandoned their historic
doctrines when it comes to liturgy and its Scriptural regulation. They're left
scrambling in trying to come up with solid arguments against some of the
abusive forms of modern innovative worship.
Some conservatives might
reckon this video a gift. No one can defend it. It would be bad enough if it
were women performing this dance. The fact that it's males makes it somewhat
grotesque and smacks of the sodomite revolution at work within our culture.
If it's supposed to
depict the Trinity, then it's not only heretical and sacrilegious, it probably
qualifies as blasphemy.
Notice they're set up for
communion in the front. Let no one doubt... this is a 'worship' service.
So much for the
Regulative Principle....so much for the Sufficiency of Scripture.... these
doctrines aren't even on the horizon for most 'Reformed' people anymore. They
pay lip service to them but in actuality reject them. Keller, the PCA's
celebrity pastor has led the charge. A Dominionist cut from modern cloth, he's
a man very much at home with the world. When you believe that heaven will look
something like Manhattan (investment bankers and all)... then the filth of
Broadway, the Theatre District and Lincoln Centre will also be part of it.
In fact Keller's Church,
'Redeemer' PCA is apropos. He
believes that all of culture can be redeemed. To put it differently, all of
culture can be sanctified and made holy. You must understand this if you wish
to grasp why men in tights are dancing around during a worship service. Ballet
is being made holy... this is (to Keller) a foretaste of heaven.
Of course this is in
addition to the jazz services they host.* It's a big package. In
reality it's the same worldly gospel of the Prosperity folks but less tacky.
It's for the refined and sophisticated people of the Upper West Side.
Keller is a big deal in
Reformed circles and he's done rather well for himself. I abandoned the
Reformed label years ago but even then I realised, if Keller, Piper, Mohler et
al. are the Reformed 'stalwarts' of the 21st century then the 20th century
Calvinist revival will be short lived indeed.
The New Calvinism that
excited so many has turned out to be something less than the previous
generation hoped. It won't last. I cannot even fathom what previous generations
of Reformed people would say about the state of modern Reformed Christianity.
*see comment regarding removal of 'reggae'.
*see comment regarding removal of 'reggae'.
When I heard about this a week or so ago, I was a bit perplexed. However, watching the video, seeing it was male ballerinas, it's even more truly bizarre. I guess Keller is trying to get more airtime on MSNBC, or as some call it, being "winsome" and "reaching the culture".
ReplyDeleteThis reminds me of a discussion I had when I was a part of a (PCA) church's staff. The leading figure announced an idea for the creation of a ceramic bowl, to be filled with oil, as a means, a sign perhaps, of mission. People would dip their finger in it on the way out, it would have something missional written on it, and it would involve one of the more creative congregants in making it. I was frustrated, and said that we already have a missionary sign, namely the Lord's Supper, and if you want to cast a vision, then add a preface before reading the words of institution. This was brushed off, but, and this was the real clincher, the leader stated that we should search the Scripture to find precedence for this. Now, it never happened, but the whole process of having an idea and going to the Bible with it, in order to justify it, horrified me. When I see things like Keller's castrated triad, I wonder if it's the same mode of thought. Do what works, what you like, whatever, and holy writ remains an afterthought.
I keep all of this in mind when one hears the hackneyed and stupid complaints from Roman Catholics, among others, about the invalidity of sola scriptura. Sometimes I wonder, to repurpose a quote from G.K. Chesterton, if it's not because it's an idea tried and found wanting, but it's been found difficult and left untried.
Reggae services? Do you have evidence of this?
ReplyDeleteI have it in my notes but I have to confess that when searching for the source... I can't find it. The notes are probably ten years old.
DeleteRedeemer certainly has Jazz, Classical, Soul music services etc. That's beyond dispute.
As much as I disagree with those forms, Reggae (admittedly) takes it to another level. Its origins are explicitly anti-Christian.
Of course, we might have the same discussion with regard to jazz. This is what happens when you stray from Scripture-regulated worship.
Your comment bothered me so I've been digging. There are some possibilities.
1. I made a mistake which very well may be the case.
2. At some point in the past they were using reggae.
3. At some point they were using 'some' reggae songs during one of the various eclectic music services.
4. I think there's also the possibility that there's another Redeemer Presbyterian church that utilised reggae and the two may have been confused. Of course that also qualifies as possibility #1.
5. Someone I was reading reported it falsely and it made its way into my notes. Again #1.
Regardless since I can't seem to come up with the source of my notes on that point... which stem from my early interactions/research on Keller... I will remove the term 'reggae'.
If you're coming from the Old Life link, feel free to report that I've eaten crow on the reggae accusation.
Please also point out that I'm not a baptist! I'm a fully consistent and insistent paedo.... thank-you (smile).
On that note, I'd be interested to know what you think of the inherent holiness/profanity of musical genres. You've stated elsewhere that you don't think, say, the rock beat, is inherently pagan or evil, but here you seem to suggest reggae and jazz are tainted in some way by their (Rastafarian/roaring twenties?) roots. I'd agree that a cappella worship is the ideal for churches, but is the reggae/jazz sound in and of itself - outside the church - evil or wrong for Christians to listen to? Similar consideration with, say the Christian metal scene!
DeleteI may have misunderstood, so let me know if so.
I don't think a case can be made for holy music. I reject concepts commonly identified as 'sacred' art, music and architecture. There is no Biblical basis for such concepts. To appeal to the OT on this point is to fall into Judaizing and to embrace an inverted and erroneous redemptive-historical hermeneutic.
DeleteWhether something like jazz is inherently wicked or evil.... in the end it's somewhat subjective.
I think every aspect of culture can probably be traced back to something dubious. Look at Jubal and Tubal-Cain.
That said, we as Christians live in the world and while we use these things, we use them as that which is perishing. We not cultural philistines but I'm not sure we're called to be connoisseurs either.
If someone wants to listen to jazz, reggae or heavy metal... that's their business. With all things I would encourage caution and most of all... wisdom.
Borrowing from Kline I embrace the idea that culture is largely common, but I maybe go a little further and place a great emphasis on our pilgrim calling. Both Dominionists and Legalists fall into the Sacral category but respond to it differently. The former says we have to capture every square inch of culture, sanctify it and redeem it... i.e. make it part of the Holy Kingdom.
The Legalist/Holiness/Fundamentalist will also say we have to create a holy culture. Rather than appropriate and transform existing norms they seek to separate and create a parallel subculture. While I am not entirely unsympathetic with their motivations the basic flaw in thinking always degenerates and devolves into legalism.
This is where I break with Holiness sects and Fundamentalists. I don't think the answer is a list of rules. Different people struggle with different things and I'm not too interested in judging what others do.
Isn't that dangerous? Doesn't that run the risk of people falling into worldliness? Yes and yes but rules cannot replace the sanctifying work of the Holy Spirit.
When it comes to the Church, this question must be addressed in a different matter.
CCM and Christian music... ugh... that's where it becomes really difficult and to be honest I go back and forth on that. I'll be frank, I don't really listen to the stuff. My wife and I grew up with it and every once in a blue moon we'll flip on the radio in the car. There was until recently a Christian music station which played a lot of 1970s and 1980s CCM. Sometimes it was fun to reminisce for a moment and listen to one of those old songs. Often we've been struck by the change in tone compared to what we hear today.
DeleteDo I want my kids listening to Petra? Not really.
But if they did... I don't know that I would be particularly upset. Once again, wisdom is required.
What if I hear an old rock song that I listened to in high school? Can I listen to it? Of course. But I'm not 'rocking out' like I maybe once would of. If anything I'm listening to it with reflection. Sometimes it's both fun and interesting to listen to a few songs but it just doesn't 'grab' me like it used to. I'm just not that interested. I'm often surprised at the messages in the songs.... messages I once missed.
Is jazz inherently evil? No more than listening to Ravi Shankar play a raga... something I actually rather enjoy. That will make some people upset. What the music means for a Hindu is not what it means for me.
Again with classical, I love Classical and Romantic era music, even some modern. For the most part I strongly dislike Baroque which includes the almost sainted (in Protestant circles) JS Bach. Musically and mechanically it's impressive... as is a lot of jazz... but I find it dull and very uninspiring.
At the end of the day, what people listen to, read and watch is between them and the Lord. A great deal of literature, music and cinema is filled with sin and shouldn't be partaken of. And yet the lines are often blurry.
Unlike Keller and those like him I do not believe we will experience Bach, Gothic architecture or banking in heaven. I sure hope we don't have to listen to Bach!
Mendelssohn... okay. (smile)
I'm not sure if I answered your question.
Ha ha. Yes, that's helpful and I fully agree.
DeleteSounds like we have a very similar approach to music. I was more into various 80s/90s post-punk/indie/dream-pop/shoegaze stuff as a teenager, but don't listen to it now... more because I'm too aware of the emotional effect a synthesized sound through a speaker can have, since it tricks our brain into thinking it's real and truly present, even if we know it's not... No doubt it has a massive shaping effect on young people listening to music 24/7.
To some degree you have to immerse yourself in the music and related scene to fully experience it... something that may well lead to a split allegiance between Jesus and the world. The metal scene is obviously pretty religious in its devotion. Every so often I delve into an obscure Christian metal subgenre out of curiosity (I'm a guitar player, so I guess I'm interested in the technique). But I could hardly listen to it often at all. Don't know what I make of that stuff... I doubt many have come to faith through it. Perhaps some. And the aesthetic... long hair seems to go against the head covering passage in 1 Cor (which I believe relates completely to hair). Most bizarre is 'unblack metal', of course...
And you're right about classical music. There is a parallel with Bach and Jazz... sounds 'nice', but entirely inconsequential to me! I'd even say that about Mozart, whose music just strikes me as frivolous. This may be entirely unfair, but I've wondered if there's a parallel in Barth's theology seeming somewhat 'frivolous' to me, since Mozart was his favourite... technically impressive, but somehow in its own bubble of cleverness, not quite touching the real world and its problems...
Out of curiosity, when you say "I'm too aware of the emotional effect a synthesized sound through a speaker can have, since it tricks our brain into thinking it's real and truly present, even if we know it's not." what do you mean? What is the "it" that's not present? The emotion?
DeleteI remember as a pagan I used to argue that Iron Maiden was worthwhile because songs like The Trooper, Aces High and Alexander the Great pointed to history. The Rime of the Ancient Mariner made one interested in Coleridge etc...
DeleteOf course there was that whole Number of the Beast thing that was always problematic. Though a pagan I had grown up in a rather schizophrenic 'Christian' home... of the Hal Lindsey and Scofield variety. Though in rebellion against it I was still very troubled as a young man whilst attending a Slayer concert. At one point I thought... what am I doing here?
Hi Cal - sorry for any confusion. I meant that, when listening to recorded music, on conscious and subconsciouslevels we think we're hearing an actual voice and instruments, but we're actually hearing vibrations of a speaker created by circuitry. So whereas before recording one only heard music on occasion from an actual human being, we can now conjure up music to alter our mood whenever we like... music that's both real and yet not real. I'm not saying it's wrong to listen to recordings or to feel an emotion in response, but you have to wonder what sort of shaping effect it has on those who listen constantly for an emotional fix... those wires leading to earpieces always visible on most of my generation may well be plugs into the Matrix, in a way! Similar considerations for tv and films... we think someone is there in front of us on some level, and yet it's merely an arrangement of coloured dots. The blurring of reality and simulacrum must affect many at a very deep level.
DeleteI had to chuckle reading some comments at Old Life. When people say 'Tim Keller is not a Dominionist' then they're clearly failing to understand what Dominionism is, and they've missed what Tim Keller is all about. I've listened to hours of him speaking and to many interviews.
ReplyDeleteTim Keller is a Dominionist through and through.
Christ the Center recently did a show referencing this same incident and expanded on it. As usual I don't agree with all that was said, but Dennison was pretty much on the mark. His language is more guarded than mine but it's clear he considers this (Dominionist/Transformationalism) a great heresy and a great danger.
I daresay one could tell he was trying to restrain himself.
https://reformedforum.org/ctc497/
Tim Keller is in the thick of it and they were absolutely correct in pointing out that what his 'church' does is closely wed to his understanding of the Kingdom.... which again is Dominionist.
I was also called a Baptist, which I am not... not even close. Sadly many of the doctrines I advocate due to the filter of the Magisterial Reformation have often been (since that time) labeled and reckoned as baptistic. That's one of the points I keep making in my writings... the so-called anabaptistic views I advocate were prior to the Reformation held by people who were not baptistic in the least when it came to questions regarding the holy rites viz., the ordinances/mysteries/sacraments. I am on the record. I am a paedobaptist and a paedocommunionist.
I was also attacked for my spelling and some tried to discredit me because I don't follow American norms. Jolly good about that eh?
Finally I was accused of perhaps false accusation in saying that Tim Keller rejects the sufficiency of scripture. I'm guilty of criticising fellow Christians. Does Keller come out and say this? Of course not. This is a point I continue to make. Dominionist theology and its claims to worldview represent a threat to Sola Scriptura itself. I think the video is exhibit A. This demonstrates where this sort of thing leads. As someone in the Christ the Center podcast said... the regulative principle is an issue here but it's not the only issue. Keller's transformational understanding of the Kingdom and thus the whole of his theology and his prolegomenical assumptions point to a dangerously broad if not fluid understanding of Sola Scriptura.
If the theology Keller represents is in danger of destroying the Church and represents yet another resurgence of an old evil... then I think my criticisms are quite warranted.
I greatly appreciate DG Hart's occasional posting of my work, but I'm not quite sure why he bothers. It's clear the vast majority of his readers are hostile to anything I have to say.
Making it onto Hart's blog has solidified your status as internet curmudgeon :)
Delete